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Novell to Release 20% of Their Employees?

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 9 years ago | from the should-have-worked-for-the-oil-company dept.

Novell 206

sicariusdracus writes to tell us that Ron Hovsepian, the new president and COO of Novell may have his hands full in the near future. Ron has been tasked with getting the troubled business back on track which many have speculated could result in more than 20% of the 5,800 man workforce getting a pink slip (although Hovsepian suggests that may be an over exaggeration). Part of the restructuring will be announced with Novell's fourth-quarter financial results.

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Act I (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936527)

Smithers: Mr. Hovsepian there's some solicitors at your door to see you.
Hovsepian: Release the employees.

Re:Act I (2, Insightful)

ChrisGilliard (913445) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936859)

+1 for parent

From the article: "The layoffs will be more about resource allocation,"

Enough with this PC stuff. Why can't they just say, something like, "We don't have the budget to sustain 5800 salarys, so we're laying off X people."? There is something to be said for Candor from executives.

fly my prettys, fly (3, Funny)

hector_uk (882132) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936533)

i just got a mental picture of evil novel monkeys with wings being released......

WHAT ABOUT MIGUEL AND NAT (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936536)

What about MIGUEL and NAT? Are they going to have to get real JOBs soon?

Who cares about the rest of the people anyways. MIGUEL and NAT are the only two main Novell engineers.

Re:WHAT ABOUT MIGUEL AND NAT (1, Funny)

geomon (78680) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936693)

MIGUEL and NAT are the only two main Novell engineers.

Just ask them! They'll tell you.

Stocks? (2, Interesting)

Gr33nNight (679837) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936538)

So after the 4th quarter results are in, that would be a good time to buy Novell stocks? $7/share is pretty tempting...

Re:Stocks? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936768)

It sells at 53 times next years earnings. That is more expensive than google. I can't think of any correct way to say that novl is cheap.

Re:Stocks? (4, Funny)

tonyr60 (32153) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936785)

SGI's are even cheaper....

Support _only_ KDE and SUSE (4, Interesting)

billybob2 (755512) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936830)

Yes $7/share is pretty tempting, but Novel's stock will only go up if they start being profitable. Novel had it coming to them when they bought Ximian, a gnome vendor that made a hodge podge of different products that are now dead (remember RedCarpet?). Novel should stick to SUSE/KDE and re-orient all its developers towards improving _only one_ application for each particular need (ie. YAST for installation/maintenance, KDE for desktop, etc).

Novel's premier Linux distribution, SUSE, is historically based on KDE yet the individual projects that they're supporting (Beagle, Evolution) are gnome apps. I think in the long run KDE will become the de-facto standard primarily because of the tight integration among its applications and excitement in its developer and user base about KDE 4. If you don't believe me, take a look at how many more posts there are in KDE-Look [kde-look.org] than in Gnome-Look [gnome-look.org] . In fact, there is KDE-Apps [kde-apps.org] for independent apps built with the KDE/QT framework, while there is no such place to aggregate gnome apps.

In conclusion, Novel should get their gnome developers to work on KDE so that they have a tightly integrated system with no duplicated functionality.

Re:Support _only_ KDE and SUSE (2, Informative)

maw (25860) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936897)

Red Carpet still exists. It's only been rebranded [novell.com] .

Re:Support _only_ KDE and SUSE (5, Informative)

Chapter80 (926879) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937078)

Novel's stock will only go up if they start being profitable.

To be clear, Novell is profitable [yahoo.com] .

EPS (ttm)=0.92 means that their Earnings Per Share for the Trailing Twelve Months was 92 cents a share. On a $7.47 share price (when I looked at the link, above), that's about 12% Earnings return on the share price (or a PE Ratio of 8.08).

That's really not a horrible return. Not great, but not bad, considering some tech companies LOSE money. It's only as high as it is because the stock price is beaten down so badly. Of course, you need to consider FUTURE earnings, not past, when buying a stock.

I'm no stock guru, but I do have what most would consider a sizeable portfolio, and I am in Novell at just over $6 (full disclosure here) for a few grand. So, yes, if I could encourage buying without touting the stock, I would. But I can't; that might be illegal.

Re:Stocks? (2, Informative)

LnxAddct (679316) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936899)

Err actually, the stock has been downgraded by several investment firms. Its expected drop a bit further even with the restructure. This will be like the 7th restructuring Novell has done in a little over a decade, if this doesn't pan out I don't think anyone will want their stock.
Regards,
Steve

A stock buy-back is in the works (supposedly). (1)

khasim (1285) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936934)

So, depending .... yes, now might be a good time to buy Novell stock.

Not to mention that the big drop in employee salaries and such will kick up the profit/expense ratio (assuming flat profits).

All of which just thrills the Street. The question is, can you get back out soon enough, at a profit before it comes down again?

Re:A stock buy-back is in the works (supposedly). (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937130)

Since the stock buy-back and potential layoffs are well known, it's probably factored into the price of the stock. So don't buy based on those facts. Buy based on the fact that it's a good "bottom fishing" type stock.

How low can it go? haha I have some of those stocks from the dot-com era.. stocks that I bought for thousands of dollars - now it'd cost more to have the stock certificate printed on a laser printer than the stock is worth. SAD!

Still, I like Novell. Hard to pass this one up. As long as they keep driving toward higher profits, we'll be in good shape!

Tee (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936542)

As in:

Tanked
Tits Up
Trashed
Trounced
Trampled
Tragic
Terrible
Ta ta
Toodle doo
TTFN
Too bad

"Over exaggeration"? (-1, Offtopic)

bcmm (768152) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936544)

That is not really OK. That's redundant, like "very unique".

Re:"Over exaggeration"? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936564)

Or like "really OK."

Re:"Over exaggeration"? (2, Funny)

bcmm (768152) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936649)

In this context, it doesn't mean "not very". It's like saying "Windows 3.1 isn't really an OS". Maybe it only makes sense in en_GB. I don't know.

Release? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936546)

It makes it sound like they're in prison!

Re:Release? (1)

Trigun (685027) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936776)

Naw, that's Electronic Arts.

released (5, Funny)

specialkp (922254) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936547)

I sure hope they're released under the GPL... It's good to see companies like this releasing human resources though. I'm going to download some today! Anyone got a torrent?

Also in business news... (1)

Tackhead (54550) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936666)

> > more than 20% of the 5,800 man workforce
>
>Anyone got a torrent?

In other news, 1160 ex-Novell employees said to be raising capital for hostile takeover of Krispy Kreme donut franchises, said to be interested in realigning business model with .torrent releases targeted directly at the Japanese pr0n market.

Finally in business news, Fuller Brush Company stock is up 50% on the day. A spokesperson for Fuller Brush Company said that despite initial concerns about the Slashdotting of their website last Wednesday, no DDOS attack in fact took place. Credit card companies have reported no chargebacks from orders; none of the PCs from which orders were placed were zombies, despite a quintupling of sales of "brain brushes".

Re:Also in business news... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937172)

> Credit card companies have reported no chargebacks from orders; none of the PCs from which orders were placed were zombies, despite a quintupling of sales of "brain brushes".

I Hate You [howstuffworks.com] .

Re:released (1)

glesga_kiss (596639) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936767)

I know, "released"? What the hell? Is that the euphanism we're using now? I forget which edition of newspeak we are on.

"Released" sounds pleasant. "What did you do today, honey?", "I got released from work!!", "Wonderful, let's celebrate!".

Meanwhile, those of us in the real world use words like "fired", "laid-off", "redundant". I can see why their market research indicated a change was required. It's like rebranding "cancer" as "closure".

600 people to be laid off (5, Informative)

Marcus Meissner (6627) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936548)

Pretty old news, it will be around 10% or 600 jobs [yahoo.com]
Ciao, Marcus

Re:600 people to be laid off (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936611)

So you're quoting an older news article that reports completely different details?
Did it ever occur to you that two different happenings at two different times could possibly be two different events?

Re:600 people to be laid off (1, Informative)

mypalmike (454265) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936682)

I guess 43 minutes is pretty old!

by Marcus Meissner (6627) on Wednesday November 02, @06:06PM (#13936548)
Pretty old news, it will be around 10% or 600 jobs


From TFA:
AP
Novell to Cut Jobs in Restructuring Plan
Wednesday November 2, 5:23 pm ET
Novell to Eliminate 600 Jobs As Part of Restructuring Plan, Expects Fourth-Quarter Charge

release... oh good, finally released... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936556)

Wait a minute, are you saying we're FIRED?

I have such a hard time with this Newspeak.

Simpsons Quote (2, Funny)

kai.chan (795863) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936755)

Burns to Homer: You can considered yourself DOWNSIZED.
Homer : What does that mean??
Smithers: I think it means you're dismissed, Homer.
Homer: Oh, good! Phew! Can I go back to work now?

Re:release... oh good, finally released... (4, Funny)

idlake (850372) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936918)

Actuall, we programmers try to think of it as "allocation", "freeing", and "releasing". So, no, they haven't been "fired", they have been "freed".

Re:release... oh good, finally released... (4, Funny)

Otter (3800) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936948)

I suppose it beats working at Sun and getting "garbage collected"...

Mono (4, Informative)

Tanaka (37812) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936560)

Lets just hope this has no effect on Mono [mono-project.com] . I'm amazed how far thay have come with the project. There are so meny sin-off projects now, it has to be taken seriously.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936647)

No. Let's hope it does have an effect on Mono. I'm seriously amazed at how stupid some people could be adopting Microsoft's technology instead of leveraging other open source technologies. I hope they fire all the Mono developers. Miguel could then go try and get a job at his favorite company, Microsoft.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936692)

I could not AGREE more. I think the ECMA pieces of .NET are just bait for fool-hardy, arrogant, and even pompous developers that think that their efforts alone can change the business model of a 60 Billion Dollar behemoth.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936783)

Oh hello! You two must be KDE users! What's it like to use a dying DE?

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937093)

Right, they must be KDE users because all the other DE's use Mono so heavily..... Idiot, none of the DE's use Mono at all for anything in the base packages. In fact the only useful program written in Mono is Beagle and I think we can all live without that bloat. Only an idiot would program anything in Mono and frankly if any DE decides to incorporate Mono I'm sure many of us will switch DE's that day.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937106)

Mono's use of Microsoft's APIs has been examined more carefully than any other open source project in history.

I suggest you put up or shut up, rather than badmouthing one of the most important open source projects in existence. Go produce a truly open, working environment similar to Mono based on APIs that you consider "open". Oh, one thing: you can forget about starting with Java, because the Java APIs really are proprietary and a legal tarpit.

Re:Mono (1)

idlake (850372) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937049)

I'm seriously amazed at how stupid some people could be adopting Microsoft's technology instead of leveraging other open source technologies.

The combination of ECMA C# and Gtk# is 100% open source technologies, and that is what open source applications are built on.

You don't have to worry about the Microsoft aspects of C#--those are part of Novell's business plan. I'm sure their lawyers have done their homework and weighed the risks. But even if they got it wrong, it has no influence on the open source parts of Mono.

Re:Mono (1)

idlake (850372) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937068)

Just to clarify: the Mono .NET implementation is, of course, also open source. But it's an open source implementation of proprietary APIs.

By "the open source parts of Mono", I was referring to open source implementations of open and free APIs: ECMA C# and Gtk+.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936790)

Micro$oft isn't even eating their own dog food. The common runtime was one of the center pieces of Longhorn. That went in the toilet and they have switched back to their old NT code base for Window Fista...oops! I mean Windows Vista.

If you want an open common platform go with something more mature and truly x-platform...Java! Sure it aint perfect, but at least major business logic has been, and is currently, running on it. And it runs on Windows, Linux, Unix, OS X, etc., etc.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936976)

> old NT code base for Window Fista...oops! I mean Windows Vista.

Is anyone impressed with this pun? Seriously, that's just lame. Stop with the "M$", "Winblows", "RedShat" etc. Nobody is moved or informed. Nobody thinks it's clever. Your nerd slang doesn't prove anything other than your own lack of creativity.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936818)

I hope they fire all the Mono developers because Mono is already dead and they're just prolonging the burial. On Windows people aren't going to use Mono as they will use Microsoft's runtime as its better in almost every possible way and it doesn't have loads of compatibility and performance problems. On Linux much of the user base won't even install Mono... So tell me where is Mono going to fit in? I highly doubt the very small number of Linux users that use Mono is going to make any difference. For example, at my work we would like to try Beagle on a few desktops however it requires the Mono runtime so it therefore is not an option.

I also know a ton of Microsoft supporters that look at Linux and laugh as it looks like Linux is just constantly trying to copy and catch up to Microsoft's technology. No matter how hard the Mono idiots try, it will never catch up to Microsoft's runtime and it will always look like Linux is just playing catch up...

Re:Mono (1)

PCM2 (4486) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937089)

On Linux much of the user base won't even install Mono...
I'll bite. Why on earth not? Especially if they already know they'd like to use Beagle. I am truly baffled.

I vet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936851)

I hope I don't catch the Mono.

I too amz amazed out how much cumz in the project are infectious Mono.

Stay awayz from meesa.

Re:Mono (1)

Tanaka (37812) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937270)

I'm blown away with Mono. I had to write a C# console app for Windoze, and I am so glad I did, because it's my favourite language now. I took the .exe compiled in Visual Studio, and ran it on my Linux box without modification. Not only did it run without any complaint, but it was able to handle more data throughput! C# is such a nice language to write in. I like Java, but C# just feels more accomplished.

Re:Mono (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937365)

Got to say, I rather like C# too, especially with the V2.0 enhancements. Mono does look cool. It certainly seems to have come a long way since I last looked at it. As soon as they get Windows Forms complete (early next year?), then I have a number of applications ready to port across.

over exaggerators! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936583)

man, i hate those over exaggerations. as if exaggerations weren't bad enough already!

help me out here... (5, Interesting)

CDPatten (907182) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936585)

All joking aside, who uses them anymore? Is their business all legacy support?

Do any of you guys use them? I guess I ask because I'm surprised they are still in business.

I hanve't seen a novell system in many years, and never hear about copanies doing a big novell roll-out.

Re:help me out here... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936623)

Im too lazy to login and mod this up, but I am curious. So someone who isnt a coward, please mod this post up.

Re:help me out here... (4, Interesting)

CoolCash (528004) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936679)

Our company does, we have 23 severs running Netware and GroupWise, in our company. They are great file and print servers with great directory services. We only have three employees managing all the servers and all helpdesk calls for 350 people.

Re:help me out here... (1)

gnuLNX (410742) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936835)

"We only have three employees managing all the servers and all helpdesk calls for 350 people."

Lucky F**&'ers. We have 3 for 900 or so.

Re:help me out here... (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936690)

You don't see them because they are the servers in the the room that just keep working. :-)

Honestly, we have quite a few Netware servers for file/print. They just run and run great.

We are migrating away from them over time, but only because of support and marketshare. Too bad really.

Not quite Banyan Vines, but oh well.

It will be interesting to see if Netware services on top of Linux (OES) will allow Novell to keep their base happy. We're playing with it now.

We had some of our Netware 4 Servers run for over a year before they were rebooted, and that was for a move. We bounce our 5 and now 6 servers a bit more frequently, but that's for patch reasons, and it's almost always months between reboots.

TTYL

Re:help me out here... (5, Informative)

deanoaz (843940) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936716)

They are still big among enterprises that value reliability and ease of use for large directories. I work in local goverment and it is our central store of identity and authentication for 12,000 users, as well as distributing applications and hosting files. Netware 6.5 provides great resources for Identity Management. Many goverment and educational sites use Netware, maybe because they typically don't have a lot of money for staff and need something that isn't labor intensive or prone to failure.

We have never had server downtime because of a virus or worm.

Novell's marketing seems to be the only weakness, the products are great.

Their hope of the future is migrating all their existing features to run over Linux.

Re:help me out here... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936831)

Installed a 200-user system last week, actually. Or maybe SLES does not count?

Re:help me out here... (2, Interesting)

Cerberus7 (66071) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936890)

We do. I don't remember what our employee count is, exactly, but it's quite a bit over 15,000. As others have said, great for file, print, email, and directory services. Novell's eDirectory (formerly NDS) is the most mature, stable, and powerful directory service package out there. Their clustering and SAN solutions are also quite excellent. Novell's Linux products aren't ready for prime time, yet, but they're coming along. By the time Netware 7 is out (_all_ Suse under the hood), the Novell Linux Desktop should be mature enough for real use. Then I can ditch my Win2K box for work tasks. *yay!*

Re:help me out here... (1)

Bulmakau (918237) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936898)

I don't really know who uses Novell anymore.
last time I saw Novell was about 14 years ago when I managed a computer center in a community center. Even then though I was wondering why they decided to use Novell (network).
I assume it is legacy as you suggest. However, I don't really know (although by itself that can be an indicative). However, legacy business can still be a good business.

One Word... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937140)

LANTASTIC!!!

NetWare 6.5 here, GroupWise 7, ZENworks 6.0. (4, Interesting)

khasim (1285) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936906)

Novell's old products are great. But their sales force sucks beyond belief. They are one of the few companies where you have to defeat their sales force to get them to sell you anything.

And you had better know exactly what you want because they're not going to offer any advice.

The only time you'll see/hear a Novell rep is when a tech support company goes cruising for clients. The Novell reps love to be driven around to see customers that they wouldn't ever call on their own.

I could double Novell's sales with nothing more than a two line phone and an email account. Seriously. Microsoft takes executives from potential clients to expensive dinners. Novell won't even waste a phone call on an existing customer. They won't even let you know when new products come out that could fit with the stuff they have on record that they sold you.

Re:help me out here... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936911)

We have 100k users using 170 novell servers running netware 6.0 sp5. Been using novell for almost 10 years now.
Works great. Has some problems (all systems do) but works well for us in our environ.

Re:help me out here... (5, Interesting)

Searaven (928019) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937003)

I think you'd be surprised who uses Netware and it's services. I work for IDC, International Data Corporation. We use Netware and Suse in most of the 47 countries we have offices in. I used to work in the corporate headquarters in the US where we have Netware 5.x and 6.x file/print/services servers in all the offices. They mostly run for over a year or more between reboots. Those are usually for service packs and rarely for abends. Netware/eDirectory is very low on the scale of adminstrative burden and it allows us to manage the network and desktops for 750+ users in 7 offices across the States with only 2 full time desktop support staff and 2 admins who also take care of many other systems. Most of our sites with 10 to 50 people don't have a local admin and run quite happily. Novell's ZenWorks is phenomenal for remote application delivery, imaging, remote control and inventory for the desktop. I moved to Australia in May to bring IDC AP over to Novell services, running on the Linux kernel with OES. It's a slow process getting the entire region ready for the change. So far I have our New Zealand office migrated and the Sydney office is very soon to follow and some of our services in Australia are already on Netware. Since I got here I've had to manage two Windows domains and though I started with NT domains many years ago I feel like I've got an arm tied behind my back administering the Windows networks, services and users. Things that are so painless with Netware are either difficult or not possible with NT domains. I've been so spoiled with Netware I can't wait to be rid of the domains! Active Directory is better than NT, but from what I've seen (it's in a few of our offices over here), it's not nearly as fully featured as the far more mature Novell eDirectory product. Our current Netware sites will gradually migrates to Open Enterprise Server runnin on the SLES Linux kernel and many of our core services are running on Linux. If it wasn't for vendors who only roll out applications only for Windows machines - Patchlink, ePo, etc, we wouldn't have any Windows servers. I agree with an earlier post that Novell's marketing efforts have always been their downfall. It's too bad really, because it is such a superior product to choice of the huddled masses.

Re:help me out here... (1)

zap_branigan (691916) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937072)

I can never understand why people think no one uses Novell anymore. We use Novell for everything for our 80,000 students. You cannot beat Netware for file/print. We use a combination of Groupwise and Netmail. Of course all identities are kept in eDirectory---the most solid, robust directory out there. Identity Manager is used to sync all systems.

You can pretty much count on all education and government being Novell or very heavily entrenched in it. If you think no one uses Novell, you are seriously out of the loop or too narrow focused.

Re:help me out here... (1)

bonius_rex (170357) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937091)

Do any of you guys use them? I guess I ask because I'm surprised they are still in business.

Hells yes. I have about 40 Netware 6.5 [novell.com] servers, 2500 users in eDirectory [novell.com] , and about the same number of workstations managed by Zenworks Desktop Management. [novell.com]

Identity management (3, Interesting)

PCM2 (4486) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937179)

Jack Messman says Novell now has two primary businesses: identity management and open source. That's the business Novell wants to go after, anyway. I think it has a decent amount of what you call legacy-support business as well, but it's constantly shrinking.

Identity management is a pretty hot area right now and a lot of companies want a piece of it, including the big guys like IBM and Sun. Novell remains a leader, however, largely because it has a superior directory product.

I wrote an article profiling Novell [infoworld.com] and it's current business prospects last year. It still pretty much holds. Try to look past the fact that it quotes Laura DiDio -- before joining the ranks of the "notorious foes of Linux," she covered Novell for years and years.

The latest news is that Novell's shareholders have been pressuring it to focus more and more on Linux and open source. I'm not sure that's necessarily the best move, because I don't think Suse Linux is generating all that much revenue so far. The open source angle seems to be perceived as the "sexiest" way to go forward, however, with the hope of reviving the Novell brand.

Re:help me out here... (1)

NeoSkandranon (515696) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937244)

My university uses Novel for the non-engineering and non-compsci portion of the student body user accounts. Not sure why, except htat perhaps it is easier/cheaper to use Novel with them, since they don't need access to the suite of tools that the engr/csci people do (Pro-E, Matlab, Mathcad, all that kinda jazz)

'Release' the Marketing Department!!! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937269)

Your post, and the many replies explaining Novell's strengths, perfectly showcases Novell's biggest problem. They have had the worst big corporation marketing department I have ever seen!

I was at their huge 'BrainShare' conference last year, and the keynote address each day takes place in a huge convention center set up with fancy audio/video & graphics for 6000 attendees. With all the money they spent, it was the worst/most boaring event of the day each of the three times they had it. Their print marketing is horrible, their graphic identity (a bunch of black and white pictures of yuppies in wierd poses) and everything else about their marketing is just putrid.

As others have stated, their Identity management products for large organizations can't be beat. Their full fledged jump into being a complete enterprise linux vendor, from the desktop to the server room, is a great move. They just need to find a way to get non-novell users to realize this!

take the money and run (1)

OffTheLip (636691) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936600)

Will Ron Hovsepian be different than many other high powered COO's in the long run? What if he fails to resurect Novell, he will be paid either handsomely as a saviour or bid adieu with a seperation package. Either way he will be far better than the pink slip recipients. It's never about the little guy when stockholders are involved. Even when those laid off deserved to be.

Re:take the money and run (2, Insightful)

vertinox (846076) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936845)

Either way he will be far better than the pink slip recipients.

I dunno about that... Not being forced to use Groupwise anymore may put you in the "far better off" category.

(Please not in the face! I do tech support for Groupwise!)

But seriously...

What if he fails to resurect Novell, he will be paid either handsomely as a saviour or bid adieu with a seperation package. Either way he will be far better than the pink slip recipients.

I think Scott Adams (Dilbert Author) had pretty good words about layoffs... (I'm paraphrasing this!) 'When they intention to make the company "lean and mean" goes wrong, it makes them "Skinny and Pissed" instead.'

CEO's think layoffs are the best way to save the company because employees are the costliest part of the company, but often those people were actually doing something (most of the time).

Think of the anology of you cutting off your fingers to keep from going hungry.

Sure it works, but over time you start running out of body parts to munch on.

Long term successful companies don't lay off employees, they find more revenue streams along with better business models and expand the business.

If you find yourself having to lay off employees, then you have to actually consider how you reached this point. Did you just hire too many people or are you failing as a company to make money? If you can't answer that question then the company is going into a death spiral and you best start looking for an exist strategy...

As for that, I suggest riding stock options by deceiving shareholders that you are actually making a profit by selling of parts of the company, firing more workers, blaming the previous CEO, suing other companies for IP infringment, and fancy powerpoint presentations.

Release? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936601)

FREEEEEEEEDOM!

Released... (5, Funny)

ch-chuck (9622) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936604)

Lets just say they've been "open sourced". 1160 people liberated, people want to be free.

But not me, I'm expensive.

Yesterday... (5, Interesting)

Otter (3800) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936624)

In the Boston Globe yesterday: "Novell trips over its Linux strategy [boston.com] ".

I'd had a feeling that that story wasn't going to get posted here...

Re:Yesterday... (2)

geomon (78680) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936665)

Why? Are you implying that a Linux-based article that has a potential negative spin to it will never see the light of day on Slashdot?

Cripes, man! Where were you (a 4 digit UID man, at that) during the endless SCO discussions?

I'm sure if you searh through everyones submission box it was probably one of the thousands of perfectly good articles that got passed over.

All is not lost, however. You got it in, didn't you?

Re:Yesterday... (2, Insightful)

Darth (29071) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936967)

I dont see why this story wouldn't get posted.

Everyone, including the financial backers, approve of the purchase of SuSE and agree with the strategy Novell is trying to implement. The problem is that they dont have faith in the executive management team to implement the plan successfully. They arent looking to scrap the company's migration to linux. They're looking at whether they should get a new management team to finish implementing the plan, or give the current management more time.

The article even includes a Linux success story at the end where a chain of fitness stores abandoned the patch-and-pray cycle of Windows in favour of a Netware on SuSE linux solution. Their I.T. manager says the move has saved them over $400k.

Even if you believe there's a conspiracy to keep articles that are negative toward linux off of Slashdot, this certainly wouldn't qualify as one.

that article is bullshit (3, Insightful)

idlake (850372) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936988)

Novell didn't "trip over its Linux strategy". Novell's primary product, Netware, was dead when Microsoft finally incorporated equivalent functionality into Windows. That's what the company "tripped over". Novell was essentially dead before they started doing anything with Linux. I find it amazing that they have managed to stay so relevant and important, and their acquisitions of SuSE and their support of Mono look like excellent ideas.

There is no way that their move into Linux was ever going to keep them going at their past levels. That's neither surprising, nor is it Linux's fault. You can make a decent business out of FOSS, but it's not going to be a cash cow like Windows or the old Novell.

I frankly can't judge whether Novell is executing right with SuSE. But the quality of SuSE as a distribution has been consistently high, and they have a good shot at selling to businesses, in particular in the European markets. I hope they'll make it, alongside RedHat and a completely free Debian; we need more and smaller companies, not a few behemoths. And, to me, the Linux distributions strike a good balance between compatibility and diversity.

Re:that article is bullshit (1)

Otter (3800) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937111)

There is no way that their move into Linux was ever going to keep them going at their past levels. That's neither surprising, nor is it Linux's fault. You can make a decent business out of FOSS, but it's not going to be a cash cow like Windows or the old Novell.

I'd say that's a pretty fair assessment of Novell's situation.

Re:Yesterday... (1)

UnanimousCoward (9841) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936998)

I'm no Linux apologist, but I don't think TFA makes any point about Linux. The only cited failure is a client moving from Novell to Red Hat. Now if said client moved to M$...

Re:Yesterday... (1)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937162)

Why? Did you expect that we'd not want to admit that you can't make money by selling Free Software? You can't. It's not a profit center. If you want to understand how its economics work. Look here [perens.com] .

Bruce

Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936639)

I know what it means to exaggerate. What in the heck does it mean to overexaggerate? Does overexaggerate mean to exaggerate too much? Can someone exaggerate and not go to the extent of overexaggerating?

released? (1)

dlt074 (548126) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936642)

into the wild?

Re:released? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936669)

I bet quite a lot of them are really wild now...

over exaggeration (1)

aktzin (882293) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936668)

Is that the opposite of "misunderestimation", as coined by a certain US President?

Will there be a 20.1RC% release tomorrow? (1)

Orrin Bloquy (898571) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936676)

Were they being kept in the basement?

So It Is True! (4, Funny)

Comatose51 (687974) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936695)

20% of the 5,800 man workforce getting a pink slip

So it is true! There really are no women in IT!

I kid, I kid.

Re:So It Is True! (1)

geomon (78680) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936713)

Actually this means that only the men are being fired.

The women are safe.

Re:So It Is True! (1)

Chris Burke (6130) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936836)

The women are safe.

I'm sure they'll both be relieved to hear that.

Not true, not true! (2, Funny)

mister_llah (891540) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936885)

It's just that Novell wants to cut down on the number of long bearded, frighteningly overweight men in IT... and increase the ratio of long bearded, frighteningly overweight women in IT... :D

===

Stereotypes are fun!

Release them? (1)

l00k (910333) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936775)

Release them? As part of a coordinated tag and release programme I assume. We'll soon be seeing poor tagged IT professionals with broken wings and tracking bands for anklets arriving in flocks all round the country, perhaps stopping at a workplace near you. A pity.

Re:Release them? (1)

Marko DeBeeste (761376) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936968)

They sterilizing them prior to release in hopes they'll stem the population growth.
...be an over exaggeration In contrast to the dealy UNDER exaggeration.

New Zealand and Novel? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13936856)

Didn't the New Zealand government just announce [slashdot.org] a big partnership with Novel? How are they reacting to all this negative news coming out of the company?

Old News - Submitted and Rejected (1)

segedunum (883035) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936882)

I submitted this days ago when it actually was news, and it got rejected. Bloody Slashdot :-).

why does everyone think novell is so good (1)

bigalsenior (869954) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936889)

netware is crap it cant sustain our collage network without crashing at least onec a day. we have 5 or six servers serviceing 400 pcs at once and some times (monday morning is the worst) it can take as long as 10 mins to get logged in and the clients are quite fast. (cel 2.4 512 meg ram ) and the windows client is bloated to hell. they should be fired it might persude the rest to make a better product. personally i think microsofts active directory is better and faster (mod me down karma is for pussys)

Re:why does everyone think novell is so good (1)

segedunum (883035) | more than 9 years ago | (#13936921)

netware is crap it cant sustain our collage network without crashing at least onec a day. we have 5 or six servers serviceing 400 pcs at once and some times

I'm sorry, I had to double check that you weren't talking about Windows there. You're just plain lying. Netware as a server is extremely solid for this sort of thing. The client could be better, but you're not going to get the management tools or anything like Zenworks from Microsoft.

personally i think microsofts active directory is better and faster

Well, it would help if you said why, but you won't be able to.

Re:why does everyone think novell is so good (1)

zap_branigan (691916) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937359)

netware is crap it cant sustain our collage network without crashing at least onec a day. we have 5 or six servers serviceing 400 pcs at once and some times You are a complete idiot then. I have over 100 Netware 6.0 and 6.5 servers and they only time they go down is when I want to patch for functionality. We have about 80,000 users as well. That you said MAD is faster and more efficient than eDirectory definitely makes me think your an idiot.

"Released" (1)

ddent (166525) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937024)

First they "lose" their employees (what, you can't find them?). Then they "let them go" (as if they wanted to). Now they "release" them (from what, a prison cell?). The euphemisms just keep getting better!

Huh? (1)

Moofie (22272) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937025)

"over exaggeration"

As opposed to an under exaggeration?

No problem... (1)

kalbzayn (927509) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937097)

Google will hire them. They are hiring everybody.

Re:No problem... (1)

pkcs11 (529230) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937226)

With you as the exception.

PHP Developer Needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937126)

Since the folks involved with this story may be reading this story. If so, and you happen to be a experienced PHP developer, please respon to this advert [craigslist.org] .

20% Open Source employees! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13937307)

nice now they're even opening their workforce for everyone to use!

5,800 man workforce? (1)

MMHere (145618) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937366)

Hey! They're in violation of equal opportunity hiring laws if they have no women on staff.

Oh, wait. They're in Utah. All the women must be at home in order to have that polygamy thing work...

In comes the Grim Reaper (2, Interesting)

blacknerd (928032) | more than 9 years ago | (#13937367)

One has got to believe that Novell will not remain an independent company for long. How long before CA, the grim reaper of IT, will acquire them, fire the remaining 80% and suck the legacy customers dry for maintenance revenue at inflated rates until they finally are fed to Microsoft? You heard it here first. Gartner analysts? - here's a new idea for you to pitch now that CA is your best buddy... (read the Ilumin acquisition press releases...) CA has always wanted an operating system anyway.... Cheers. -blacknerd
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